I just want to start this one off by saying that we have TWO new videos for you this week – one of them is up now and you can watch it on our youtube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvKr7SJqs44
And the next one will be up on Wednesday. I certainly can’t commit to doing two every week but this week I had some extra time and footage.
We are working on the streaming thing but I may as well explain the situation to you – our internet is shit, and we have an upload speed of 1 Mbps on average (advertised as 10, but according to my boyfriend, not what we actually get). So we need something way better. Unfortunately, getting new Internet is taking forever for various reasons – one of which being that our current company is taking 75 years to customer serve us, and the second being that a lot of plans with the kind of speed that we need are apparently not available in our building. And because we live in a rented apartment we can’t just go and install whatever wiring we want.
Fingers crossed that we’re able to sort this out because it’s been something of a dream for my boyfriend for a really long time. But until then, we have our youtube channel, so if you want to actually watch us play or just want to support us, maybe consider subscribing to that at least for now. We would really, really appreciate it 🙂
This week I decided that I should start paying attention to the free rotation more and play every champion that I don’t own at least once. I stopped doing it because I only had so much time, but now I have all the time in the world, so I feel like it can only help.
As a result I played lots of people this week I haven’t played in ages! Including….CAITLYN!! AKA the Basic Bitch of League, according to me. Upon playing her again I definitely feel like she is less basic than previously thought, because now I know how her traps work, but she’s still pretty basic. But honestly, basic can be a good thing! If anything, League NEEDS more basic. She’s fun though, and while her hat and outfit still enrage me to NO end, I definitely plan on adding her to my collection. Eventually.
I tried Tryndamere again, and I’m thinking I might actually buy him sooner rather than later because I need more top lane champions and I actually didn’t fail that hard when I played him in an ARAM.
I tried Ryze for the first time and my boyfriend/the Internet is always going on about how bad he is but he’s actually pretty cool? His abilities are pretty neat. I think that if they gave him a new ultimate (something more damage focused) he could be viable and I think that would be fun for a lot of players who like mages. I honestly am not sure what use he possibly has for a teleport, especially considering how short ranged it is. Like yeah, you can get slightly closer to an enemy, but he’s already ranged and has an instant root. And he can get further away, but if you’re actually trying to get away in a pinch it probably wouldn’t work because of the channel time. So…???
I tried Udyr again and I actually think he’s pretty cool now as well. Kind of complicated and definitely not playable outside of the jungle, but his whole ‘thing’ is neat.
I also played Swain, Vayne (lol that rhymes), and Nocturne but my thoughts on all of them are the same. I like them but I’m not like HOLY SHIT about them.
I ALSO played Sion again, except that was in an ARAM and I couldn’t remember anything about him so you can guess how that went. It was pretty funny though and at one point I ult-ed into a wall. Times like that I really wish I was recording. But we can only film with my boyfriend’s computer, and also I refuse to show my face in our videos without makeup because my skin is so bad. And I’m not the type of person who wears makeup everyday, mostly because I’m lazy but partially so that I don’t make my bad skin worse.
In another ARAM, I got Soraka, which is always a good thing, but in this case I also happened to be matched with a bunch of lower level players (on both teams). Or at least, I’m guessing that they were lower level because most of them didn’t have keystone masteries and also because I was running circles around them. And you know how often that happens. So it was a really nice feeling – I ended with a score of 17/3/50 and got an S, but I also felt bad too. I know how it feels to be matched with players who are clearly just 10x better than you because that is 90% of my games. Times like that I really wish I could honor opponents because they took it like champs (then again, I don’t have All Chat on).
The day before, my boyfriend and I were playing an ARAM and the enemy team had a Soraka, and he told his friend to “ignore” the Soraka. And I was like um, rude. And he said, “Well you know what I mean, it makes more sense to go for the other players first because Soraka does no damage.” And then 2 minutes later, he got killed by the Soraka. KARMA. Honestly, he should know better than to say things like that to me. That’s like if I suddenly transformed into one of those people who apparently think that all Yasuo players are monsters.
My favourite part of my League week by far though was when I played with a couple of players who were streaming the game. My boyfriend watched via their stream and was hanging out in the chat there for a bit so it was nice that he was able to be involved in that way, rather than just hovering over my shoulder.
When I got into the lobby for that game, someone from Riot immediately said, “OMG you’re famous!” And I mean, I’m not, but pretty cool nonetheless. (If I’m so famous, why does our youtube channel only have like 70 subscribers? Half of which are from when I used to post ukulele covers?)
It was a really nice experience overall though. They had a discord chat going so I joined but didn’t talk. Discord makes me extremely uncomfortable – my social anxiety/general weirdness makes it hard enough for me to talk on the phone with one stranger, let alone several. But I do really enjoy hearing everyone else talk because it’s just entertaining, usually.
I don’t think I played too many PvP games this week, but I did play Blitzcrank in one finally and got an A. So my confidence was bolstered, but quickly deflated again when I played him in a PvP game with my boyfriend later and failed miserably. However I still think that he’s fun to play, and the person that I played with in that first game taught me how to whisper, so that was useful.
The second game as Blitzcrank though raised a question in my mind – why don’t junglers ward? I guess I never questioned that before because in my own games I never really had an issue with warding, but in the games I play with my boyfriend, they expect me to place wards fucking everywhere and go wandering around by myself. And I’m like…why isn’t the jungler doing this? They’re ALREADY IN THE JUNGLE wandering around. They could just place wards as they go. One argument might be that junglers are often behind in gold and levels, but the same is true of supports. I think that it would be great if junglers could be in charge of the “deep” wards and supports could focus on supporting whoever they’re with at the moment and shallower wards.
Maybe this is not a problem in higher ranks but for me, wandering around alone is a death sentence. No matter who I’m playing. And as my boyfriend said himself, wards are no good if you’re dead. There were also a few times in our games this week where he would tell me that we need wards in a certain place, and I’d be like, “…so should I go there then?” and he’d say no, it’s not safe. I’m glad that he acknowledges that but it also highlights the problem that I’m addressing here.
It pisses me off so much when I’m asked to be a human sacrifice just for the sake of how the game “should” be played. In addition, this means leaving your ADC alone, and again, maybe in higher ranks this is not a problem, but in my games that could be a death sentence for them too.
What started this discussion was that I bought Face of the Mountain, which was the most recommended item for Blitzcrank (and Maokai for that matter). There are no wards included with that item, but I figured that maybe tank supports are meant to do other things. However, my boyfriend asked me (as did the rest of our team, rather passive-aggressively) why I didn’t have a Sightstone and why I wasn’t warding as much, and when I explained he just said that a Sightstone is mandatory at all times if you’re playing support. Apparently if you build a non-warding starting item, you still ALSO have to buy a Sightstone. And that’s just really shitty for the support player. My boyfriend has since informed me of the existence of Eye of the Equinox, which is almost the same as Face of the Mountain, but still. Supports should be able to have the freedom to maybe not get a Sightstone if it doesn’t make the most sense for them. This though could be changed simply by Riot altering support items or the warding trinkets some more.
So, you tell me – why does it make more sense for supports to do the majority of jungle warding rather than the jungler?
Death snack of the week: Doritos (honestly, it’s probably going to be Doritos most of the time; we go through 2-3 bags per week)
11 thoughts on “Why Don’t Junglers Ward?”
the jungler isn’t reliable, in 1 game he might never come bottom because there isn’t opportunity to gank, so you’d have no wards whatsoever. the jungler also doesn’t have space for a ward item. warding is the supports job, just like it’s the adc’s job to do high consistent dmg. ofc other characters in the game can do that too, just like with warding, but then one that definetly needs to be doing it, is the adc just like warding is with a support 🙂 it’s part of the role you pick. (at least that’s how i see it)
That’s basically just saying “because that’s the way it is”, the way that a mom says “because I said so” to their kid when they ask too many questions lol. I’m saying, why is it impossible to challenge that paradigm? Is it really impossible? Are there good reasons for it? For example, why can’t junglers buy wards (they have the same number of item slots as everyone else and like I said, supports are behind on gold/levels too)? Why can’t the jungler ward as they’re clearing camps, which they’d always be reliable to do, even if they don’t go to lane?
You may not have those answers – maybe those answers don’t even exist – but that’s what I’m looking for, not necessarily just descriptions of “what’s done” because I’m already familiar with that. Of course though I do appreciate any help that anyone offers me and anybody who bothers to listen to my opinion at all. I also know that I could just google this, I just thought I’d ask you guys first lol
I mean yeah, you could change that, you could change any part of the game really. But why? If you took warding from supports they would just be even more stuck in bottom lane only doing 1 thing, in pro games the supports often roam across the map and help out in multiple lanes, warding on the way, just like you want the jungler to. If you took that away you’d have to give support something instead i feel.
Your right i don’t have the answer 😛 but it’s a neat discussion 🙂 i’d say the junglers don’t have space for warding items because they loose too much strength from buying it, then they loose a fight to the other jungler who didn’t buy it, and boom your team is behind. You could make better warding items for junglers and you’d see more warding from them i guess.
Yeah I think maybe the answer lies in changing items around to give more flexibility so that supports can ward if it suits their team/playstyle or not, and same with junglers. Because I personally don’t want to wander around but I understand that higher level players do, and I think both should be options!
I would say that that could be the case, depending on how the playstyle of your jungler turns out to be. If he is a damage dealer, the item slot that he would lose with the sightstone would hurt his damage output. Most supports on the other hand build life regen, mana regen, life and such, where the stat of sightstone (+health) helps is more useful.
Also you’re quite right about the “that’s the way it is” argument and its very true. This changed for the better though, as passive gold items weren’t a thing back in the days and supporter basically “existed” for placing wards. They were poor af (at least it seems like it, I became a main supporter in the brighter days of supports). And frankly, the whole idea of the supporter is to help your ADC, so being able to warn them in advance if a jungler or the midlaner apporaches is a very useful help too.
I myself find it very satisfying to know that I helped with my wards (in the end of game stat graphs you can look up your vision score, which basically tells you, how much your warding/destroying wards helped your team), although there is no real direct appreciation for that ingame.
Long story short, supports are on a good way of being more meaningful besides being a warding machine, but it has it’s rights to be part of the identity of the “supporter” of the team.
I definitely think that the support items have improved even since I started playing, and I agree that warding is important – I actually like warding – I just think that there should be more ways to do it, I guess? For example maybe for your team or your own playstyle/skill level (as in my case) it might not be practical for the support to do the deep warding and I think that it should be possible for the jungler for example to help out with that. But maybe that is not possible at the moment
Warding is accessible to junglers, via trinket wards, control wards and tracker knife (jungle specific item similar to sighstone). Some of them just decide not to use those options.
I’m not a jungle main by any means, but allow me a quick rundown:
Trinket wards: it’s customary for junglers to swap trinket early to a sweeper, for vision denial purposes, which makes sense to some extent, but if you see yourself not utilizing that, it may be a better idea too keep waridng trinket for longer, and drop wards while jungling.
Control wards: anyone ob the team can buy them, but from my experience they rarely will. While I can understand not willing to buy a lot of them, even a couple in a game will help with vision a lot.
Trackers knife: is an upgrade to a jungle item similar to sighstone that grants two ward charges per recall. Other options are blue smite, which allows you to smite champions for damage while slowing them, and red smite, which also allows smiting players, but reveals them, makes them take additional burn off of junglers autos, and reduces their damage.
And while i can understand, tak for some very carry oriented junglers those are useful, i do think that tracker’s knife is not utilized enough.
It is also possible for junglers to just buy sighstone, what was considered meta at some point, even in professional league.
So the problem is not in availability of warding items, but in aproach of the junglers (or players in general) – warding itself doesn’t feel significant. You just drop a ward and it’s done. No cool explosions, no direct gain, no instant gratification. It can be rewatding when you pay attention to your wards, and have people to communicate with about where you seen (or not seen) enemies, but for some people it is just a chore. I would also assume, that some people think that since it’s a support’s job to provide vision, they can completely ignore it, and even feel entitled to being provided with vision by others.
Haha that is an interesting perspective. I guess that makes sense, it certainly does feel that way sometimes even to me. Maybe if items were changed so that it didn’t feel like you had to pick one OR the other and you could have your cool explosions and still be warding as you go along. I mean, I’m not necessarily saying that junglers should go wandering around where they’re not already going to be cause that is a waste of time, but by nature of being a jungler, you’re gonna be in a lot of different places as is so it would be nice if they were more incentivized to ward along those pathways when they can. But I know that some do, I’m always very appreciative of those ones haha
There are two major Arguments for Supports to ward:
1. A covered itemslot on wihch you cant build dmg or healthyness
2. Timemanagment. A junglers is pretty much occupied with clearing his camps. And if hes not clearing camps, you want him to gank. So every time a Jungler goes Warding, he is doing that instead of ganking or clearing out his camps.
The supports main role is to proterct and help the adc/team.
And you are right, if you go warding you dont protect your adc. But there is not the constant pressure to protect him. So a support got way more free time to spend. like when the enemy bot lane is backing.
But with like everything in LOL its complicated. A good supports knows when he has sparetime to ward safley. And he wards because he has this sparetime and dont has to CS or CS in the Jungle.
Also its not up to you to wards. Every Player should buy a Warding trinket at the start. But these wards dont last as long as sightstone wards. Also they are supposed to buy Controlwards.
So what is wrong is that Support is responsible alone for the vision.
If you count it: 4 Controlwards and 4 trinketwards is 8 ward constantly on the map. So even when the Sup doesnt ward, there should be plenty of vision on the map. Its especially in lower elo games that nobody is warding and blames the support for it.
So to wrap it up:
In laning phase you want your sightstone, so you can put down wards in the river to see a gank coming and maybe also in a laning bush. So in laning its just for the adcs protection.
In lategame the Sup has the Sightstone because of itemslots. SO then he also protects his team with vision.
All in all i would say there is just no difference between going warding and protect your adc/team.
Also if the support dies warding, its not that bad as it would be the jungler, because hed miss a lot of CS.
Watching streams, sometimes I do see junglers (NB, for example) dropping some deep wards when he invades a bit. Junglers who are more utility based also have a bit more flexibility in getting more wards. Lee Sin pretty much has no excuse not to have a Sightstone, since it /also/ provides him with escape utility (ward jumping).
I generally prefer playing some of the beefier bruisers (J4 .>).
3) Placing her bomb on the enemy tower vastly increases its AoE (just be careful about it hitting the enemy champs when it detonates, so tower doesn’t target you).
4) Explosive Shot (E) does a small AoE when you last hit a minion or tower – that’s her E’s passive. This means that she’s pretty much guaranteed to push the lane. Consequently, warding is very important, but if you have an aggressive support, you can create a lot of pressure at bot lane. It creates opportunities for the enemy jungler to gank bot, relieving pressure on your other lanes. Just be ready to book it if their jungler is coming. Let them waste their time. If you use E’s active on their tower when their minion wave is coming in, you can clear their wave much faster as well.
5) Sometimes, if you’re judicious with your aggression, you can W in to get that fourth hit on a target that has E on it, since it’ll reset your W and let you Rocket Jump right back out again.
6) Her ult can count as one of the hits for her E.
7) For pushing the wave faster, feel free to use her E on the minion wave. Especially on the cannon minion.
8) Because of Explosive Shot’s passive, last hitting under your own tower can be tricky. Can take a bunch of practice to get that right, lest you miss a lot of cs.
If you have any other questions about her, feel free to ask me. ^.^
“….and he told his friend to “ignore” the Soraka. And I was like um, rude. And he said, “Well you know what I mean, it makes more sense to go for the other players first because Soraka does no damage.” And then 2 minutes later, he got killed by the Soraka. KARMA.” hahahahahah xD wtfff
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